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Post by suuuuuuuuuuuuugar on Apr 26, 2024 5:52:50 GMT
Flower was my favorite since day 1 and still is. Not sure why, she's just awesome and that's how it goes.
What are your thoughts on her redemption arc in BFB? Personally, I thought it was handled poorly, and the sweater thing felt like it came out of nowhere. My personal headcanon was that she's a good mechanic (made the Announcer crushers, Flower Speaker Box, possibly even built Robot Flower as a way to have a second chance at winning), not a model. I'm a bit disappointed that that side of her wasn't explored much.
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Post by Exit on Apr 26, 2024 12:58:11 GMT
Agree strongly about her "redemption arc;" I hesitate to call it an arc, since its pacing makes it feel more like a heel turn. While I'm not opposed to the concept of her becoming less of an overt dick as a form of character development I would have preferred that a) she kept any semblance at all of her personality as it was pre-change, and b) that a process of development unfolded on-screen at all. My personal headcanon was that she's a good mechanic (made the Announcer crushers, Flower Speaker Box, possibly even built Robot Flower as a way to have a second chance at winning), not a model. I'm a bit disappointed that that side of her wasn't explored much. Also a fan of this! I don't hate the sweaters as a concept so much as I don't understand why those specifically were chosen. I guess the overall theme in how Flower has been done by BFB in particular is "clipped potential." |
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Post by Pony on Apr 26, 2024 17:20:08 GMT
Flower's Arc Worked on Me as a Teenager But As I've Gotten Older It Is Kinda Like Hey... Why Was Her Arc About Getting Nicer and More Feminine? Its Weird in a Way BFDI Isn't Normally Which is a Shame. I Do Think Giving Her Friends and Making Her Grow and Change as a Person is Good, But The Way Its Executed Both Wasn't Interesting and Kinda Made Me Raise an Eye... Which is Such a Shame Because the First Ever Eliminated Winning BFB Is Cheeseball in All the Ways I Like!
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Post by cam on Apr 26, 2024 18:26:04 GMT
Flower redemption arc was mid, I got SO hype over flower in BFB 11, THAT SHIT WAS AWESOME!!!! I fucking campaigned to make sure flower wasn't voted out
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Post by behindthetimes on Apr 26, 2024 19:16:29 GMT
Flower's Arc Worked on Me as a Teenager But As I've Gotten Older It Is Kinda Like Hey... Why Was Her Arc About Getting Nicer and More Feminine? Its Weird in a Way BFDI Isn't Normally Which is a Shame. I Do Think Giving Her Friends and Making Her Grow and Change as a Person is Good, But The Way Its Executed Both Wasn't Interesting and Kinda Made Me Raise an Eye... Which is Such a Shame Because the First Ever Eliminated Winning BFB Is Cheeseball in All the Ways I Like! gonna fight you on this. she didn't get more feminine. flower has always been one of the more outwardly feminine characters. she fits into a countless number of (generally negative) feminine stereotypes, from the way she treats people, to the way she boasts about her appearance, to the fact that she is the only character who gives a rat's ass about the concept of "fashion" before BFB.
furthermore, in a season that went out of its way to take its previous character arcs more seriously, it makes perfect sense to recontextualize pre-IDFB flower as a genuinely toxic and harmful person and treat her like someone who should learn better. of course when flower gets "redeemed" her feminine traits would manifest in more "positive" ways. it isn't perfect but it's never struck me as harmful.
the biggest failing is that we are never really given a spoken reason for flower to want to improve herself (as far as i remember) but i don't think anyone was too bugged by that at the time. i mean, being flower is reason enough, right? from bfdi 25 onward she is constantly punished for being who she is. the other characters make a concerted effort to keep her dead or incapacitated for as long as possible. if i were her i'd question what got me to that point too.
if there are more specific points you have about the way her arc in postsplit is written then i'd love to hear about it, but to me, flower is a victory for bfdi in a lot of ways.
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Post by Pony on Apr 27, 2024 2:33:04 GMT
gonna fight you on this. she didn't get more feminine. flower has always been one of the more outwardly feminine characters. she fits into a countless number of (generally negative) feminine stereotypes, from the way she treats people, to the way she boasts about her appearance, to the fact that she is the only character who gives a rat's ass about the concept of "fashion" before BFB.
furthermore, in a season that went out of its way to take its previous character arcs more seriously, it makes perfect sense to recontextualize pre-IDFB flower as a genuinely toxic and harmful person and treat her like someone who should learn better. of course when flower gets "redeemed" her feminine traits would manifest in more "positive" ways. it isn't perfect but it's never struck me as harmful.
the biggest failing is that we are never really given a spoken reason for flower to want to improve herself (as far as i remember) but i don't think anyone was too bugged by that at the time. i mean, being flower is reason enough, right? from bfdi 25 onward she is constantly punished for being who she is. the other characters make a concerted effort to keep her dead or incapacitated for as long as possible. if i were her i'd question what got me to that point too. if there are more specific points you have about the way her arc in postsplit is written then i'd love to hear about it, but to me, flower is a victory for bfdi in a lot of ways.
I Guess Feminine Is the Wrong Word, Docile Might Be Better? Whatever It Is I Do Just Wish We Preserved SOME of Her Attitude From Before. I Do Agree Though, While It Is Easy to Assume Why Flower Would Want to Change We Are Missing a Scene That Actually Gets the Arc Rolling for Real. She Just Kinda... Starts Doing It? A Lot of Post Split is Characters Just Start Doing Something Its Not Awesome. I Think I'm Just Biased Against It Because One of the Most Fun in Theory Scenes of Her Trying to Do Good (Hanging Out With Teardrop in the Oven Mall and Teardrop Taking Advantage of Her) is Shoved in One of the Worst Episodes of Post Split. A Lot of Her Redemption (The Temple Bullshit, The Sweaters, Oven Mall) Are All Very Bad Post-Splitisms So While I Want to Like It I'm Bogged Down By How Much It Just Kinda Isnt Good |
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Post by suuuuuuuuuuuuugar on Apr 27, 2024 19:40:04 GMT
the biggest failing is that we are never really given a spoken reason for flower to want to improve herself (as far as i remember) but i don't think anyone was too bugged by that at the time. This. If you don't give characters good reasons to do the things they do, then they are not believable. Why would she want to have her own fashion line all out of the sudden? It maybe would've felt more natural if they snuck in just before adding that trait a scene where she's lonely and talks with Yellow/Purple Face, saying something like: "Sigh, you know, Y F, you may be an insult to the whole concept of good looks, not having petals and all that. And yet, somehow, you still have more people genuinely liking you than me! Or just tolerating you, or something." Yellow Face then replies: "Being an owner of a blooming business has its PERKS!" Flower: "Huh? Blooming? Business?" Yellow Face: "The Non-slip shoes? The paper slips? All me!" Flower: "Oh, I never realized that. Hm, what if I started my own business then?" Yellow Face: "You can! Just don't forget to buy my business gui-" Flower (interrupting him): "With, the, uh... (nervously looks around) new non-slip shoes! And rings! And petals! And sweaters! Sweaters! It'll be sweaters!" Yellow Face: "Hey, you can't STEAL my ide-" Flower: "Thanks for the idea, Yellow Face! (running out) Don't worry, I'll make sure to give you a discount on the petals."
Or something along those lines.
Maybe they could've developed her odd friendship with Ruby? Maybe Ruby gets fed up with her needy nonsense, which forces Flower to analyze why the first person willing to compliment her left. Nope, that story thread got cut off too. DESPITE THEM BOTH STAYING IN THE SPLIT. These ideas are so obvious they write themselves. Though, these blunders can happen when you're forced to write scripts fast, considering how frequently the episodes came out at that time.
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Post by behindthetimes on Apr 28, 2024 1:44:24 GMT
This. If you don't give characters good reasons to do the things they do, then they are not believable. Why would she want to have her own fashion line all out of the sudden? It maybe would've felt more natural if they snuck in just before adding that trait a scene where she's lonely and talks with Yellow/Purple Face, saying something like: "Sigh, you know, Y F, you may be an insult to the whole concept of good looks, not having petals and all that. And yet, somehow, you still have more people genuinely liking you than me! Or just tolerating you, or something." Yellow Face then replies: "Being an owner of a blooming business has its PERKS!" Flower: "Huh? Blooming? Business?" Yellow Face: "The Non-slip shoes? The paper slips? All me!" Flower: "Oh, I never realized that. Hm, what if I started my own business then?" Yellow Face: "You can! Just don't forget to buy my business gui-" Flower (interrupting him): "With, the, uh... (nervously looks around) new non-slip shoes! And rings! And petals! And sweaters! Sweaters! It'll be sweaters!" Yellow Face: "Hey, you can't STEAL my ide-" Flower: "Thanks for the idea, Yellow Face! (running out) Don't worry, I'll make sure to give you a discount on the petals."
Or something along those lines.
Maybe they could've developed her odd friendship with Ruby? Maybe Ruby gets fed up with her needy nonsense, which forces Flower to analyze why the first person willing to compliment her left. Nope, that story thread got cut off too. DESPITE THEM BOTH STAYING IN THE SPLIT. These ideas are so obvious they write themselves. Though, these blunders can happen when you're forced to write scripts fast, considering how frequently the episodes came out at that time.
HAHAHAHA oh my god yeah i almost forgot!!! remember when flowruby was basically canon and then they never talked again as soon as they stopped being written by lgbt writers who believed that their characters were people and cared about continuity  |
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Post by mintykiwi on Apr 28, 2024 15:32:11 GMT
Flower was my favorite since day 1 and still is. Not sure why, she's just awesome and that's how it goes. What are your thoughts on her redemption arc in BFB? Personally, I thought it was handled poorly, and the sweater thing felt like it came out of nowhere. My personal headcanon was that she's a good mechanic (made the Announcer crushers, Flower Speaker Box, possibly even built Robot Flower as a way to have a second chance at winning), not a model. I'm a bit disappointed that that side of her wasn't explored much. okay now i NEED to see more mechanic flower |
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Post by nikshalark on May 1, 2024 1:12:29 GMT
Whoever the Flower shrine person was/is, please come back. Your fancomic where the BFB cast is trapped in a cave and say slurs at each other was the best OSC content of all time.
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Post by mintykiwi on May 1, 2024 19:45:56 GMT
Whoever the Flower shrine person was/is, please come back. Your fancomic where the BFB cast is trapped in a cave and say slurs at each other was the best OSC content of all time. what is the flower shrine i need to know |
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Post by behindthetimes on May 1, 2024 20:05:25 GMT
Whoever the Flower shrine person was/is, please come back. Your fancomic where the BFB cast is trapped in a cave and say slurs at each other was the best OSC content of all time. ❌ that was lollipop! |
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Post by cam on May 1, 2024 20:16:45 GMT
Whoever the Flower shrine person was/is, please come back. Your fancomic where the BFB cast is trapped in a cave and say slurs at each other was the best OSC content of all time. ❌ that was lollipop! YEAH I WAS WONDERING THE SAME THING i had only heard of the massive lollipop shrine which is awesome bc i love lollipop |
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Post by mintykiwi on May 3, 2024 12:56:26 GMT
YEAH I WAS WONDERING THE SAME THING i had only heard of the massive lollipop shrine which is awesome bc i love lollipop i can build a flower shrine if yall want, i'll fill a box or something with pictures of flower and an LED candle and maybe some flowers in a vase as well |
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