viscera zombie
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its all about the he-said, she-said bullshit >_>...
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Post by viscera zombie on Apr 28, 2024 14:20:57 GMT
There is Such a "Follow the Leader" Problem Where People Just Do Stuff to Do Stuff Because Other People Did It, Not Knowing Why Those Things Happen. It Really Causes Us to Stagnate I Think yeah, this mentality befalls most first-time show creators. it's because they're kids, and this is usually the first thing they've ever made. as they grow up and inevitably cancel their first show to start on another, it blossoms into a mindset where they're like "i'm older now, i know how to make things now, and i'm right about what i do and don't need to be instructed" which leads to them spending months on creatively dead ideas with complete confidence because they've never tried to analyze what they like and determine what makes it good. it doesn't help when their main inspiration is Object Invasion or something either.
there are a million shows you could point to that are the result of this, but i'm going to single out The Nightly Manor for fun. the creator did nothing but work on other peoples' shows for years, surrounded himself with people that were more talented than him, and held onto a single, flawed idea that entire time. the result was a reboot of his first object show (WHICH YOU SHOULD NEVER DO) with a confused release schedule, half-baked story, and a script that makes me want to gouge my eyes out. despite this, due to him having The Entire OSC behind him, willing to go along with every creative decision without question, he managed to make something so flashy and cinematic that it became one of the most talked-about shows of its time.
he made shit, and nobody pushed back on it. instead, they spent countless hours polishing his shit until it looked nice, and the entire community fell for it, meaning that there was even less chance of his work ever being properly criticized. how will he grow creatively from this? will he be able to make something with this much support again if/when he actually has a good idea?
what a terrible environment to make something in.
can i ask why you think people should never reboot their first shows? i have my fair share of cancelled shows/comics with a few making it a bit into production before getting scrapped and while i dont think i'd ever reboot any of them, i HAVE rebooted my current project because i liked the idea and wanted to improve what i had, and i would argue i learned a lot both creatively and improved my abilities as a writer (though i know my work still isnt perfect).
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behindthetimes
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Post by behindthetimes on Apr 28, 2024 19:06:16 GMT
can i ask why you think people should never reboot their first shows? i have my fair share of cancelled shows/comics with a few making it a bit into production before getting scrapped and while i dont think i'd ever reboot any of them, i HAVE rebooted my current project because i liked the idea and wanted to improve what i had, and i would argue i learned a lot both creatively and improved my abilities as a writer (though i know my work still isnt perfect).
im sure its perfectly possible to remake your first show and make something good out of it. it can be done. however, i cannot think of a single time that an object show has done it successfully. it's inherently limiting to lock yourself into an old idea, and if you try to improve and expand on it, you'll inevitably make enough changes that you might as well be making a new thing. the desire to NOT make something entirely original might even cause you to subconsciously hold yourself back from making positive changes!
the line between "remaking something" and "making a new thing with obvious inspiration from the original" is a very thin one. i recommend going into it with the latter mindset because it'll make you more likely to actually look at your project and identify problems where you might not have wanted to previously. run ALL of your ideas through the wringer. question EVERYTHING. it can't just stay because it's "what we did last time."
related: i really hope the object invasion reboot never happens
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viscera zombie
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Post by viscera zombie on Apr 28, 2024 19:36:26 GMT
can i ask why you think people should never reboot their first shows? i have my fair share of cancelled shows/comics with a few making it a bit into production before getting scrapped and while i dont think i'd ever reboot any of them, i HAVE rebooted my current project because i liked the idea and wanted to improve what i had, and i would argue i learned a lot both creatively and improved my abilities as a writer (though i know my work still isnt perfect).
im sure its perfectly possible to remake your first show and make something good out of it. it can be done. however, i cannot think of a single time that an object show has done it successfully. it's inherently limiting to lock yourself into an old idea, and if you try to improve and expand on it, you'll inevitably make enough changes that you might as well be making a new thing. the desire to NOT make something entirely original might even cause you to subconsciously hold yourself back from making positive changes!
the line between "remaking something" and "making a new thing with obvious inspiration from the original" is a very thin one. i recommend going into it with the latter mindset because it'll make you more likely to actually look at your project and identify problems where you might not have wanted to previously. run ALL of your ideas through the wringer. question EVERYTHING. it can't just stay because it's "what we did last time."
related: i really hope the object invasion reboot never happens
when you put it that way i guess i see what you mean? i definitely can say that the current iteration of Roadkill is so vastly different from the original in terms of its story that the only real similarities are the fact that theyre the same characters and basic concept. and the opening scene is similar but thats only to set up whats ahead. in that sense its still technically a remake but still something completely new. i didnt wanna limit myself to the exact same story beats of the original and just try to improve on the issues i had because i wanted to redo the entire thing and when doing that i kept looking back at the original and noticing more things i wanted to change, and even after finishing the rewrite i was still constantly changing things until i got something i was happy with... even now i change small things here and there in advance cuz i realize they dont really work as well as i thought they did... so yeah, in that sense i can see the difference between making something new but similar vs trying to copy the original idea entirely. i guess thats the difference between a good and bad reboot, for me, at least. |
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foam
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Post by foam on May 3, 2024 23:15:33 GMT
I've always wanted to see the outside world of competition shows. Who watches Object Shows? Do they have a camera crew, or a production team behind it? Where's the paparazzi and gossip tabloids? It would have been an interesting parody of celebrity culture. Furthermore, do the objects we know and love have a life outside of the show, and what brought them into it? Was it all a facade and contestants would act very differently outside the show? The pressure to compete and the greed that comes with winning can change someone. This!!!!!!!!!! The actual "this is a show" part of the premise gets ignored when it can have so much potential for world building purposes and character motives!!
An object show project I wanna make a comic of someday goes off the premise of focusing less on the contestants on the show and more on the whereabouts of production team and what they get up to. +commentary on how reality tv is faked/exaggerated and so on
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cam
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Post by cam on May 4, 2024 2:23:36 GMT
I've always wanted to see the outside world of competition shows. Who watches Object Shows? Do they have a camera crew, or a production team behind it? Where's the paparazzi and gossip tabloids? It would have been an interesting parody of celebrity culture. Furthermore, do the objects we know and love have a life outside of the show, and what brought them into it? Was it all a facade and contestants would act very differently outside the show? The pressure to compete and the greed that comes with winning can change someone. This!!!!!!!!!! The actual "this is a show" part of the premise gets ignored when it can have so much potential for world building purposes and character motives!!
An object show project I wanna make a comic of someday goes off the premise of focusing less on the contestants on the show and more on the whereabouts of production team and what they get up to. +commentary on how reality tv is faked/exaggerated and so on
seconding the "show" part!!! I've never shown that stuff in episodes before, but in my shows lore, everyone and their mother knows about this object shows. It became the most famous show in the universe, because it actually finished, and was pretty decent, compared the other hosts in the universe who always failed to make an object show work. It's really funny and neat lore! |
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Post by Pony on Aug 4, 2024 19:30:12 GMT
Rebooting This Old Thread Because, While This May Not Fit PERFECTLY, Feels Better to Put It Here Than Make a New Thread.
Has Anyone Else Noticed How Much More Parasocial the OSC Has Been in Recent Years? The Way the ii or JnJ Crews are Treated Recently is Very Offputting and Clingy, Especially Considering How Prevalent It Is Now Compared to the Mid 2010s (Where Ironically You Could Join Discord VCs With Them or Talk to Them One on One on Tumblr). It Feels Like The Further Away the Crews Are, the More Overbearing and Invasive the Fans Have Been. Its Creepy!
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viscera zombie
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its all about the he-said, she-said bullshit >_>...
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Post by viscera zombie on Aug 4, 2024 19:56:53 GMT
Rebooting This Old Thread Because, While This May Not Fit PERFECTLY, Feels Better to Put It Here Than Make a New Thread. Has Anyone Else Noticed How Much More Parasocial the OSC Has Been in Recent Years? The Way the ii or JnJ Crews are Treated Recently is Very Offputting and Clingy, Especially Considering How Prevalent It Is Now Compared to the Mid 2010s (Where Ironically You Could Join Discord VCs With Them or Talk to Them One on One on Tumblr). It Feels Like The Further Away the Crews Are, the More Overbearing and Invasive the Fans Have Been. Its Creepy! i havent really, but thats probably because i dont really interact much with the fandom outside of friends and my own personal fanbase. although i have absolutely experienced some strange behavior from fans despite being such a small creator - particularly people freaking out when i join discord servers and such, and it really bothers me because i'm literally just some chick, and i dont like being put on a pedestal just because one day in high school i decided to make a comic while listening to Rob Zombie in class, lmfao. its not entirely the same issue - i wouldnt call that "parasocial", just kind of weird and overbearing to be treated like basically Jesus sometimes. its still very creepy, and can lean into being downright invasive when that behavior starts to turn into people thinking they're entitled to my time. i can't even begin to imagine just how much more overbearing it gets for the larger creators who have to deal with this clingy behavior on a much more regular basis, and in much more extreme ways.
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treasuredguardian
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Post by treasuredguardian on Aug 8, 2024 1:55:31 GMT
Rebooting This Old Thread Because, While This May Not Fit PERFECTLY, Feels Better to Put It Here Than Make a New Thread. Has Anyone Else Noticed How Much More Parasocial the OSC Has Been in Recent Years? The Way the ii or JnJ Crews are Treated Recently is Very Offputting and Clingy, Especially Considering How Prevalent It Is Now Compared to the Mid 2010s (Where Ironically You Could Join Discord VCs With Them or Talk to Them One on One on Tumblr). It Feels Like The Further Away the Crews Are, the More Overbearing and Invasive the Fans Have Been. Its Creepy! Definitely. I've seen it with PPT2's creator. Tumblr alone had people ask Yellow these weirdly specific questions. Some were even invading the privacy of some of the crew members. Some people tell me it's worse on his discord. Not the only place I've seen it mind you, but I've seen enough to know it wouldn't be any different otherwise... It sucks that this isn't surprising...... I get why people do this, it just isn't healthy for anybody involved. |
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treasuredguardian
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Post by treasuredguardian on Aug 8, 2024 6:35:42 GMT
Who's gonna say it? It's capitalism/infinite growth. If you want to grow your audience you will attract weirdos whether you liked it or not. Set boundaries and you'll also end up limiting who can interact with you. It's just a contest of who's the most popular or who gets merch sales. ...I know... I was just pointing out while it was bad, there is a reason for these people to be like this. It's a whole discussion, really... And I know enough that I shouldn't say more on it anyway....... That's all. |
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Post by suuuuuuuuuuuuugar on Aug 11, 2024 21:39:14 GMT
Rebooting This Old Thread Because, While This May Not Fit PERFECTLY, Feels Better to Put It Here Than Make a New Thread. Has Anyone Else Noticed How Much More Parasocial the OSC Has Been in Recent Years? The Way the ii or JnJ Crews are Treated Recently is Very Offputting and Clingy, Especially Considering How Prevalent It Is Now Compared to the Mid 2010s (Where Ironically You Could Join Discord VCs With Them or Talk to Them One on One on Tumblr). It Feels Like The Further Away the Crews Are, the More Overbearing and Invasive the Fans Have Been. Its Creepy! I like answering questions sometimes, but I'd be lying if I didn't say that it's also so mentally draining. People just ask questions about these tiny details I never thought about because it's not important to the story, so most of the time I don't know what to say or make it up on the spot. Even some crew members ask these questions. |
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natus
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Post by natus on Aug 24, 2024 14:35:41 GMT
ok soooo me nd CD have been watching a few object shows together lately this is a super small not-big issue teensy tiny little nitpick i have (as a character design standpoint thing) i really wish ppl didn't start giving objects eyelashes, it just never looks good to me IMHO, and plus its just super unnecessary. BFDI already did it perfectly by not giving the female characters eyelashes nd keeping them all generally GNC when u think abt it (leafy is a perfect example of this, her androgynous voice is literally everything to me) so like adding eyelashes just kinda goes back on that? not that its a bad thing i just find it lame. on top of that it doesn't look good with the simple little dot eyes, maybe in a different artstyle yes it looks good! but when its a dot with a line i feel like it looks wonky, like its right on the eye/eyebrow c'mon. maybe i just like the simplicity of the eyes? also like man if ur gna add lashes can they not only JUST be on the girls too? give me a male object with eyelashes ! give me a NONBINARY object with eyelashes ! some variety would be nice? shrug.
ofc like im not gonna kill anypony for doin this stuff, i could care less, i just like simplicity and not highlighting what gender these characters are haha (lighthearted i promise)
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natus
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Post by natus on Aug 24, 2024 14:42:35 GMT
I've always wanted to see the outside world of competition shows. Who watches Object Shows? Do they have a camera crew, or a production team behind it? Where's the paparazzi and gossip tabloids? It would have been an interesting parody of celebrity culture. Furthermore, do the objects we know and love have a life outside of the show, and what brought them into it? Was it all a facade and contestants would act very differently outside the show? The pressure to compete and the greed that comes with winning can change someone. LITERALLY THIS!!! i think this is why i loved IDFB so much initially was cuz we got to see these characters hang out outside of a competition, AND u got to see a bit more of their world! i also wonder what these guys do outside of these..do they go places? do they live anywhere? i mean for the most part they live out in the wild hahaha, even tho there IS housing you never see anyone really....LIVE anywhere. one of the things i liked abt ii was that they had a cute little hotel where the eliminated contestants hang out in, and they got cute rooms! (oh yea and tpot has that too! i hope we can see more) its so much better than sending them to what's essentially hell (TLC, idiotic island, etc) i do hope we can get some more down to earth stuff where we get to see objects hang out! pull back on the competition and lemme see what they do when the "cameras" are off please!!! theres so much opportunity with some of these shows and this concept too!!! |
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Post by CD on Aug 24, 2024 14:53:09 GMT
ok soooo me nd CD have been watching a few object shows together lately this is a super small not-big issue teensy tiny little nitpick i have (as a character design standpoint thing) i really wish ppl didn't start giving objects eyelashes, it just never looks good to me IMHO, and plus its just super unnecessary. BFDI already did it perfectly by not giving the female characters eyelashes nd keeping them all generally GNC when u think abt it (leafy is a perfect example of this, her androgynous voice is literally everything to me) so like adding eyelashes just kinda goes back on that? not that its a bad thing i just find it lame. on top of that it doesn't look good with the simple little dot eyes, maybe in a different artstyle yes it looks good! but when its a dot with a line i feel like it looks wonky, like its right on the eye/eyebrow c'mon. maybe i just like the simplicity of the eyes? also like man if ur gna add lashes can they not only JUST be on the girls too? give me a male object with eyelashes ! give me a NONBINARY object with eyelashes ! some variety would be nice? shrug. ofc like im not gonna kill anypony for doin this stuff, i could care less, i just like simplicity and not highlighting what gender these characters are haha (lighthearted i promise) Even when It's only the very feminine female characters it's still Only Women. No one ever does it on men or nb characters. And even then, I prefer If people didn't do it at all. It feels kinda backwards when the whole cast doesn't have any other means of expressing gendered traits physically. Plus It like, never looks good. Most of the time the eyes are just One Line so anything extra feels off. On the other hand, I mind it less in fanart that gives them circular eyes. It works a lot better imo, can be pretty cute. However the rule of "don't just give them to girls" still applies to me. |
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treasuredguardian
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Post by treasuredguardian on Aug 24, 2024 16:17:35 GMT
I WAS JUST TALKING ABOUT THIS A WHILE AGO!!! As someone who like drawing eyelashes on characters, using eyelashes as a binary gender marker is annoying. Especially if it doesn't even fit the characters involved. Even then, I feel it would be more fair if they gave it to male or nonbinary characters if they don't use it as a marker but include them anyway (love PPT2, a shame that we have confirmation that none of the male characters are getting eyelashes. I can name 3 who at least fit). Also yeah, I have to admit that the eyelashes used tend to not gel well with the shape of the eyes. I can only remember one show off the top of my head that does give a male object show character eyelashes... I can't remember the title though. >_< EDIT: IT WAS OBJECT LEGENDS!!!
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viscera zombie
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its all about the he-said, she-said bullshit >_>...
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Post by viscera zombie on Aug 31, 2024 21:47:01 GMT
i recently started giving all my characters eyelashes regardless of gender bc i just like eyelashes. peace and love on planet earth
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